Monday, January 25, 2016

KRISHNA MATH LESSON #1

There's "conventional math." There's "new math."
There's "core math", etc.
and then there's "Krishna math..."
Lesson 1,
We consider (0,1) to be Krishna, all inclusive.
That is, Krishna is the emanating source of everything
and yet is not everything.
We consider signs + and - to be directional forces emanating from Krishna
In 2 dimensions we see a line.
-__________________________(0,1)_________________________+
Which represents quantitative measurement and directional force.
In mathematics the quantitative measurement... how much or to what degree... is represented by integers. 0,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9
Because there are 10 integers in this system it is called base 10.
In Krishna math..
"-" indicates illusory existence perpetually interrupted by time as a limiting factor.
"+" indicates uninterrupted existence in three levels of participation... impersonal, localized and devotional.
In three dimensions we see a double vortex. (see illustration)
Scientists are studying this and call it the "God particle."
If we look at conventional math written in it's more familiar shortened version...
3+3=6 Is really more accurately written
(+3)+(+3)= (+6) to include the directionals.
The integers are the quantifiers... how much or to what degree...
And
The signs "+" and "-" are the directionals.
Adding 2 positives makes the result more positive.
Increasing the positive quantity in the same direction.
and the same with negatives (-3)+(-3)= (-6)
Adding negatives makes the result more negative
increasing the negative quantity in the same direction.
That's why 2 wrongs don't make a right. :>)
Then there is (-3)+(+5)=(+2)
Something of lesser negative quantity or degree
when combined with something of greater positive quantity or degree
makes the overall result positive to some degree.
This is the great value of devotional association.
Then there is the opposite...
(-5) + (+3)= (-2)
Something of greater negative quantity or degree
when combined with something of lesser positive quantity or degree
makes the overall result negative to some degree.
This is the danger of association with those
who are more strongly attached to material sense enjoyment.
The overall result is negative.
This activity of attraction is all pervading
and can be seen to lesser and greater degrees in everything.
Attraction is the inherent nature of the absolute,
referring to Krishna as the All-Attractive.

Sunday, January 24, 2016

MOST EFFECTIVE MASS EFFORT

Devotee comment:
"They do not know how to manage society." -Srila Prabhupada
Meena Devi Dasi:
And when things get completely out of hand they take everyone to war. We are at that point.
Devotee comment:
the three modes are in control.... it's amazing how everyone thinks he is the doer when in actuality the three modes are the puppet masters
gross ignorance is why yoga and dharma is the only chance for humans to actually become human and then make advancement rather than transmigrate in the digressive direction back down into the lower species of life
no brahma jnana being taught to the members of society because brahmins and cows are not being protected... women and children are not being protected
it's tough out there on a bhakta, but, it's very tough out there on the rest of the citizens who care very little for transcendental knowledge, thinking it's generally a waste of time
Meena Devi Dasi
Yes. It is the material modes only. That is why there is no material solution however attractive such a "solution" may appear. Even if the mode of goodness were to start to prevail people would remain materially conditioned by a sense of happiness without coming into contact with the representatives of Krishna.
Devotee comment:
exactly right...
Meena Devi Dasi:
Although there are so many difficulties ISKCON is still the most effective mass effort at bringing people into contact with Krishna consciousness.

COW AND BULL CONNECTION TO HUMAN CIVILIZATION

Devotee comment:
Cows are the most important animals on this planet!
Many times Christians who like eating dead animals,
ask us "why do you Hindus worship cow?
They live just so we have something to eat! It is their purpose in life! 
To live and give us their meat."
For many years I did not know what to say to them but,
"God loves all animals, so love the animal that is closest to you".
Few years ago I would start saying "Lord Krishna loves cows, so do we."
But few days ago thanks to Meena Devi Dasi mataji,
I watched a youtube video about the importance of cow herding.
Mind blowing! Cows make earth productive with crops and grass and water! Amazing! Without cows the land turns to desert in just a few years!
Meena Devi Dasi:
Glad that helped.
Those who are cultivating spiritual life intuitively know
killing and eating animals is horrible.
But the vast majority of people who are not yet desiring
spiritual advancement don't feel anything.
So having this practical problem placed before them
gets things going in the right direction.
A lot of people are aware of this problem now
just in this practical observable sense.
Krishna has appeared to stop all this.
When people really get the cow and bull connection
it's going to be huge leap forward for the world.
It's a good thing these times we are living in are being well-documented
because in the future people will not be able
to relate to the depravity that is now.
It will look so bizarre to them. Hare Krishna.

ROOTING OUT FAULT FINDING

Whenever my intelligence falls asleep
and I fall into this bad habit of "fault finding"
it seems really enlivening at first.
"Yes, I'm really getting energy from this. Energized."
But then after a little while I start to feel really badly.
There is no joy. There is no wonder and amazement at Krishna consciousness. Only a kind of sour dissatisfaction with myself,
and every one and everything.
So I am starting to recognize this pattern.
From other experiences in the past of rooting out unwanted things,
I see that it is a gradual process. First learning to recognize what it is
and then learning to stop it sooner. Cutting it back. cutting it back
finally locating the source of it. The root.
And then there is no need to go there.
Been there done that. I know where it starts
and also I know where it goes.
"No thank you. Hare Krishna." Then it is gone.
It is not first class intelligence.
It's more like 3rd class bordering on 4th class,
but I have to work with what I have.

Saturday, January 23, 2016

THREE GUARDS

Myself and another mataji had been collecting donations and distributing books inside Sun Valley Mall, CA, during a Christmas marathon in the mid 80's when were apprehended by three guards.
They were very insistent that we leave and escorted us to the exit
and remained watching us until we got into our vehicle.
Usually when were told to leave a place we would wait a little while
and then go back in and let them kick us out again.
But this time the guards were very firm and made it known
we would be arrested if we came back in.
So we started to drive away.
As I looked back to see the three guards I had to do a double-take.
The three figures looked like Jagannatha, Subhadra and Balarama.
Two men and one short lady standing between them.
I really did have to rub my eyes.
We reluctantly left and spent the rest of the evening at Toysarus parking lot.
The next morning there were front page headlines....
"Four-passenger private plane crashes into roof of Sun Valley Mall."
The people in the plane died. It was an horrible accident.
The plane crashed through the roof just above the Santa Claus exhibit
in the center of the mall... showering burning dripping plastic over everyone.
I looked at the time of the accident... 8:45 pm.
We were forced to leave at 8:30 pm.
Oh Krishna...

A twin-engine light plane crashed into the middle of a big shopping mall jammed with thousands of shoppers…
ARTICLES.LATIMES.COM

Monday, January 18, 2016

HA HA YOU DO NOT EVEN PROTECT THE WOMEN

The Western society, now seriously materially contaminated,
doesn't know what is actually valuable.
The land (messed up), the cows (killed and eaten),
their own money (all stolen and gambled away),
the women and children (unprotected)...
Anyone from a culture that actually recognizes
what is valuable to human society can see the foolishness.
Missiles and bombs cannot protect a society that is rotting from the inside out.
These Muslims are ridiculing the Western industrialized nations,
the men.... by openly assaulting the Western women.
Ha ha you do not even protect the women. Just see.

HEAT IS ALWAYS PRESENT IN FIRE

Great illustration to get some idea of how Krishna's "inconceivable" potencies act...Krishna is compared to the fire. Heat is compared to His potencies.
"Heat is sometimes present in water, air, or other elements, but it is always present in the fire-element, and can never be separated from it.
Just as heat is always present in fire, in the same way the inconceivable potencies of the Supreme cannot be separated from Him. They are an intrinsic part of His nature." Bhag. Sandh.14.12
The heat is coming from the fire even though it can be detected in water or air.

NOT JUST INTELLECTUALLY

"As the sun remains in one place, although its potency, the sunshine, expands in all directions, so the personality of Godhead remains in one place, although His variegated potencies are everywhere." Bhag, Sand.14.16
Looking at this verse... "the sunshine expands in all directions"
it occurred to me that when I think of the sunshine
I tend to think of it as it relates to me... not that it expands in "all" directions.
The sunshine expands not just in the direction of the earth...
but throughout the entire universe. It is very subtle.
In other words, intellectually I know from hearing from authorities
that the sunshine expands throughout the universe,
but in my own personal little experiential world I think of it
only in relationship to "my" material bodily existence.
Our realization of transcendence is like that. We may accept intellectually,
but when the rubber hits the road we still identify
with the gross and subtle bodies as the self.
Everything in relationship to the false self.
By engaging the material body and mind in devotional activities
we become purified of this misconception not just intellectually
but also at the points of contact with the material energy.
The bonafide spiritual master engages the disciple like this.
Not just intellectually.

Sunday, January 17, 2016

GURU TATTVA #14 AUTHORIZED

Guru Tattva #14
Devotee Comment:
On this lecture Srila Prabhupada says:
“BONA FIDE GURU means HE MUST BE AUTHORIZED BY THE SUPERIOR GURU.”
HE MUST RECEIVE THE ORDER FROM THE SUPERIOR.
And THE SUPERIOR MUST BE BONA FIDE.
THEN HE´S BONA FIDE,NOT SELF-MADE.•
----------------
https://old.prabhupadavani.org/.../Nectar_of.../NOD06.html
"The Complete Science of Bhakti-Yoga #6"
72/10/31 Vrndavana
He is self-made guru.
Therefore he's not guru.
Self-made guru cannot be guru.
He must be authorized by the bona fide guru.
Then he's guru.
This is the fact.
Here...
Nobody can be self-made anything.
A medical practitioner, he cannot become self-made, that
"I have studied all the medical books in my home."
No.
"Have you ever gone to the medical college and taken instruction from the bona fide teachers?"
Then, if you have got the certificate, then you are medical practitioner.
Similarly, bona fide guru means he must be authorized by the superior guru.
Just like Caitanya Mahaprabhu says,
amara ajnaya guru hana tara' ei desa
[C. Madhya 7.128].
He must receive the order from the superior.
And the superior must be bona fide.
Then he's bona fide, not self-made.

Meena Devi Dasi :
>>>>"Have you ever gone to the medical college and taken instruction from the bona fide teachers?" Then, if you have got the certificate, then you are medical practitioner. Similarly, bona fide guru means he must be authorized by the superior guru.<<<<

This is the point Srila Prabhupada is making.
That the guru comes in line of disciplic succession.
He has gone through the system.
He has approached His guru maharaja and been trained by Him.
Not that he reads books and hangs a sign outside his door... doctor...

This is the authorization Srila Prabhupada is talking about.
That he has gone through the proper procedure
like the medical student who goes through the school of medicine
and receives his certificate to practice.

But if the student is not a very good student
then he is not qualified for a full medical degree.
In India he can practice medicine but his certification is limited.

So not only does the student have to be authorized
by going through the proper system,
but he also has to be qualified.

GURU TATTVA #12 PHASE ONE PHASE TWO

Guru tattva #12
Vaishnava culture as it relates to the books....
Uttamasloka Dasa:
Here's another angle. Book distribution is an essential aspect of spreading the knowledge, and it's much more effective because there's too much information to convey in conversations. But book distribution in and of itself is not the sum and substance of 'spreading the mission'. It is only phase one of the mission, ie: get the knowledge into the hands of conditioned souls.

Phase two is to assist those who respond favorably to that knowledge and express a genuine eager interest in moving forward on that path. That is sadhu-sanga. Those who are serious and become devotees must then be guided by various gurus until they attain prema. Then the mission for that jiva is complete.

GURU TATTVA #13 NOW MY FRIEND IS VERY SERIOUS

Guru tattva #13
"So as soon as I become serious to know about Krsna,
Krsna can understand, 'Now My friend is very serious.'
So He will find out a bona fide guru for him."
Hmmm. You mean Krishna really has something to do with this?
NECTAR OF DEVOTION LECTURE #6

GURU TATTVA #11 EKALAVYA

Guru tattva #11
Ekalavya..Tragic...
We can't help it, our hearts go out to Ekalavya.
He wanted so intensely to study military arts in Dronacharya's gurukula.
But Ekalavya's heritage was aligned with Duryadhona 
and he also was not a kshatriya by birth.
By birth was serious consideration when the age of varna and ashrama
was fully functional 5000 years ago.
Dronacharya refused to allow Ekalavya into the school.
Ekalavyas' desire was so strong to become the best archer in the world
that he performed great austerities, and practiced nonstop in the forest.
He worshiped Dronacharya as if he were his guru
even though he had been refused as a disciple.
And indeed he became an incredible archer.
Of a quality to be able to challenge Arjuna and possibly defeat him.
But this was not what Dronacharya wanted.
He didn't want just any great archer, he wanted Arjuna to be the greatest archer because of what Arjuna would have to do in the future.
Fight on religious principles.
Ekalvaya did not have the divine mandate.
And even was aligned on the opposite side of religious principles.
While in the forest one day a display of talent
was seen by Dronacharya and Arjuna.
Ekalvaya sealed shut the mouth of barking dog with arrows. Poor dog.
Seeing this Dronacharya approached Ekalvaya and discovered
his practicing and considering Dhroancarya his guru.
What to do? This went against the master plan.
Since Dronacharya was his guru albeit unbeknownst to him,
but nonetheless still so.... and this unusual disciple was there,
then there should be guru daksina.
Dronacharya asked for Ekalvaya's archery thumb.
The lesson here is so profound.
I am overwhelmed every time I remember this account.
I am reminded of the ritviks.

Saturday, January 16, 2016

AKRURA WAS SENT BY KAMSA

A devotee who I disagree with on certain Krishna conscious siddhanta
has suggested I philosophize less and chant more.
I really don't see the difference when the philosophizing
is in relationship to Krishna.
I might suggest to them they use their intelligence a bit more
in the service of Krishna.
I was considering this today...
Before Akrura came to Vrndavana
to take Krishna and Balarama to Mathura none of the residents
knew that the brothers had another aspect....
That they were born in the the royal family.
They related to Krishna and Balarama as most wonderful members
of their simple cowherd society,
Creating a kind of innocence that allowed
for complete intimacy in all relationships.
When Akrura arrived that innocence was taken away
from the residents of Vrndavan and another feature
of Krishna and Balarama became known.
Not only were Krishna and Balarama taken away from them
but also their innocence.
It was like someone has a very intimate loving relationship
with someone else and then they find out something
about them that shocks them.
The person is not who they thought they were.
Although the residents of Vrndavan did sense
that there was something very unusual about the two boys.
Sometimes they thought they might be demigods.
Mother Yasoda thought in innocence that Krishna was her child.
Akrura took that innocence away.
The cowherd boys thought in innocence that Krishna was a dear friend.
Akrura took that innocence away.
The gopis thought in innocence that Krishna was their secret lover.
Akrura took that innocence away.
Akrura was sent by Kamsa.

GURU TATTVA #10 TWO WRONGS

Two wrongs don't make a right..
1st wrong... gurus can be appointed
2nd wrong... no one can become guru
So what is the right?
Who is qualified... they can become guru.

GURU TATTVA #9 DISCUSSION HENCEFORWARD

Discussion on guru tattva #9

The typical ritvik stance:
Devotee comment:
Henceforward is defined as from a certain time on without cessation. It's simple for the simple and complicated for the complicated.
When Satsvarupa Maharaja asked Srila Prabhupada on May 28th 1977 how initiations would go on after his departure Srila Prabhupada replied that he would appoint officiating Acharya's, Ritvik representatives.
It's clear to me who was there and heard it myself.
Others who want to accept their own disciples can do so in their own temples.
For ISKCON he ordered the Ritvik Initiation System 'Henceforward!'
From then on without cessation. AGTSP!
Who lives on and his followers live with him.

Meena Devi Dasi:
 Henceforward depends on the circumstance which prompted the order. "Hence" in this case was dependent upon Srila Prabhupada's ill health.
Since my health is too poor,
Hence (which also means "therefore"...) the order for ritvik initiations.
Once the original condition is no longer there,
as in the case of Srila Prabhupada's disappearance...
obviously it is not a matter of ill health any more...
He actually disappeared...
then the "hence" no longer is valid.

Henceforward does not mean forever...
It means for an indeterminate amount of time.
The amount of time being determined by Srila Prabhupada's ill health.
If He were to have recuperated,
that henceforward order could have been rescinded.

The system is the disciples become the gurus
when the spiritual master leaves.
This is determined by qualification, not by appointment.

GURU TATTVA #8 10,000 PEOPLE PANDAL

Discussion on guru tattva #8
It is like there is a big pandal program,
10,000 people and Srila Prabhupada is speaking there.
Everyone can hear and everyone is benefited.
Reading the books is like that.
Those that are really fortunate will want to approach
the person spiritual master and become
more intimately associated with him by serving under His direction.
After Srila Prabhupada leaves the planet, His books are still there
and everyone can still benefit from them,
but He cannot be approached for initiation.
He has left the planet.
His disciples who are still on the planet must be approached.
That is the disciplic succession.
But not everyone will take initiation. That is alright.
The benefit is still there by reading the books.
But that is the system. It is an eternal system.
Since the beginning of time and did not end with Srila Prabhupada.
Devotees who are preaching that no one is to accept disciples in ISKCON
are misled and are misleading others.
It is very unfortunate. Their spiritual progress is blocked.

Friday, January 15, 2016

HOW THE MASTERS DEFEAT

Am appreciating how the masters I have been able to study
defeat those with misconceptions.
Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati was faced with Brahmanism
as a barrier to Vaishnavism in His time. 
With reference after reference to support the Vaishnava philosophy
He proved beyond any doubt the Vaishnava conclusions.
But He did it in such a way as to not crush the defeated.
That their understanding was valid to a point
but showing where it fell short and
to simply to put things in their proper place.
A loving chastisement meant set them straight not to destroy them.
Similarly Srila Jiva Goswami. Reference after reference to establish the Personality of Godhead as the sumum bonum...
faced as He was in his time with the strong Mayavada doctrines.
Utterly defeating the Mayavada philosophy...
showing it's limitations in such a way as to not destroy anyone.
Simply to put things in proper perspective...
a loving chastisement to set them on the right path.

GURU TATTVA #7 THE HENCE IN HENCEFORWARD



Discussion on guru tattva #7
The "henceforward" argument.
The ritvik philosophy is based on the July 9th letter.
Here we see Srila Prabhupada has Tamal Krishna Maharaja 
write up a letter to be sent to all the leaders in ISKCON.
Srila Prabhupada is appointing eleven senior disciples
to act on his behalf as ritvik acaryas
in the matter of Harinam initiation and brahmana initiation.
The disciples initiated in this way will be Srila Prabhupada's disciples.
The use of the word "henceforward" has caused some confusion.
The definition of the word henceforward is given:
"from this time on or from that time on."
This has been taken by the ritviks to mean from now on no end ever
and they have taken the position that Srila Prabhupada
has ruled out anyone else ever taking disciples within ISKCON.
Even after His disappearance.
But if we break the word down... we find it has two part..
"Hence" and "forward."
The definition of hence is given...
"because of a preceding fact or premise : therefore."
There is a causal element. In other words,
Hence....due something there is such and such...
When we put "hence" with the word "forward"
we see a deeper meaning. Because of something...
it will be like this in this future.
Now we have to ask what was that "something"
that required the use of "hence?"
What was it that established ritvik initiations?
Srila Prabhupada was incapacitated. His health was just too poor.
That was the "hence" ...the reason for the directive for ritviks.
Hence... due poor health... That was all.
When He would disappear that "hence" was no longer valid
since it simply referred to his condition of poor health.
Those that were initiated from July to November of that year
when Srila Prabhupada disappeared
are indeed Srila Prabhupada's initiated disciples.
It is clear He never appointed spiritual masters.
Spiritual masters are always recognized
by qualifications never by appointments.

GURU TATTVA #6 SALT IN THE CANRAMRTA

Discussion guru tattva #6
Ritvik and guru tattva
This is what it's like.
Just like this...
In LA temple Srila Prabhupada was there.... mid 70's
As was His routine, He would enter the temple room
which was crammed full of devotees,
walk to greet the Deities with Yamuna devi's beautiful
Govindam prayers playing...
and offer full obeisances to each of the altars.
Everyone offering obeisances with him.
and then stop to take carnamrta ...the Lord's bath water mixed with
yogurt, sugar and rose water, Tulsi leaves and buds floating on top.
This time however He was unhappy.
The carnamrta water had been mixed with salt and not sugar.
He was very unhappy.
He stopped everything and asked who had prepared this.
One of ladies stepped forward,
embarrassed, frightened, nervous and .....giggled.
Srila Prabhupada was disgusted and said
"Put someone responsible in charge."
The point is He didn't change the program.... no more taking carnamrta....
because someone messed up.
Simply, someone with the proper qualifications
of responsibility, etc. should be in charge.

GURU TATTVA #5 MANIFEST SB 1.10.36

Discussion guru tattva #5
Where is the quote saying he must be present on the planet for us to give Diksa on his behalf as he instructed?
Meena Devi Dasi:
There are many references. This is one. From the purport SB 1.10.36
"...in all actions, the experienced guide, the spiritual master, who is the manifested mercy of the Lord, should always be consulted, and the path of progress will be assured."
The word "manifested" indicates being present.
The spiritual master is the manifestation of Supersoul.
There is an element of impersonalism in the ritvik philosophy.
It is not simply the physical body that has disappeared
and somehow now Srila Prabhupada is an all-encompassing spirit
like the holy ghost or something.
There may be that aspect. The connection with paramatma aspect.
But this is Lord Chaitanya Mahaprabhu's movement and is Bhagavan
in the mood of Sri Chaitanya mahaprabhu in five features.
It should be clear from study of Chaitanya Lila.
The mood of separation is part of the lila.
For this there has to Disappearance. Once He is gone He is gone.
Then there can be the mood of separation.
The disciplic succession continues eternally.

Thursday, January 14, 2016

AFTER A SPIRITUAL MASTER DISAPPEARS

After a spiritual master disappears there are some things that should not be done: 
#1 Edit His books and claim that He has somehow approved of the editing 
after His disappearance from the planet 
and to not clearly identify that they have been edited and by whom.
#2.Claim He has given you diksa after His disappearance from the planet.
#3.Claim He has "appointed" successors diska gurus when He clearly has not. This is validated by His definitive teachings that a spiritual master is always by qualification.

BIG PANDAL PROGRAM

One thing I see is that some people think that
simply hearing from Srila Prabhupada in His books is enough.
In one sense it is. In another sense it isn't.
It's like there is a big pandal program and there are 10,000 people. 
Srila Prabhupada is speaking and everyone can hear. Everyone is benefited.
Now someone who is eager to make further progress
will approach Srila Prabhupada for initiation.
But if Srila Prabhupada has left the planet they cannot approach Him.
They must approach someone in line of succession who is still on the planet.
Sometimes I hear people say... "Srila Prabhupada is the last acarya."
This is crazy. If anything He is the first acarya (ISKCON founder acarya)
and also His title. Prabhupada...
The spiritual master at whose feet other spiritual masters take shelter.
Not the spiritual master at whose feet there are no other spiritual masters.
This issue has been confusing to me for 40 years.
It is not confusing anymore. I am thankful.
Now I am free to serve my spiritual master in the mood of separation.

WHO IS ACTUALLY THE FATHER?

Thinking about it... Mahabharata...
Some of the key personalities were not fathered
by who they are commonly referred to as being fathered by.

Since Vichitravirya had passed away leaving his queens without sons. Satyavati requested her son Veda vyasadeva to conceive sons in the wombs of his half brother's widowed wives.

Dhritarashtra, Pandu and Vidura were actually fathered by Veda vyasadeva, (who was not a kshatriya), the son of Satyavati and Parasara muni and half brother of Vichitravirya.

The Pandava brothers were not actually conceived by Pandu.
Pandu had mistakenly killed a sage thinking him to be an animal
while hunting in the forest. The sage cursed Pandu to die if he ever tried to engage in sexual activitity. The "Pandavas" were conceived on behalf of Pandu by mantra that Kunti had received as a gift from Durvasa muni for her pleasing service.

Wednesday, January 13, 2016

GURU TATTVA #4 LAST ACARYA?...IMPERISHABLE SCIENCE

Discussion on guru tattva #4
In response to this recent post:
"So although a physical body is not present, the vibration should be accepted as the presence of the Spiritual Master, vibration. What we have heard from the Spiritual Master, that is living" (Lecture, 13/1/69, LA)
Devotee comment:
This is the MOST heartening news!!! That we, who are feeling bereft of the personal association of our beloved Gurudeva, can KNOW he will ALWAYS be present and guiding us exactly like SriParamatma..... this is the most munificent and glorious compassionate nature of Guru... our dearmost friend and trancendental teacher, Srila Prabhupada KI JAYA!!
Meena Devi Dasi:
Yes for those of us who are initiated by Him.
Others will need be initiated by a disciple of Srila Prabhupada.
There is much confusion about this.
The tendency is to say
Srila Prabhupada is the "Last Acarya." Which is rubbish.
There was a problem with this sort of thing
when He was physically present too.
It was being promulgated by some
that Srila Prabhupada was an incarnation of God.
He stopped that immediately.
Disciplic succession is eternal. It is always going on.
Krishna describes the process as "this imperishable science of yoga."
People are very confused about this.
Sudra or less do not need initiation.
But it is the mission of the Vaishnavas to raise people
from sudra or less to brahmana Vaishnava if possible.
The disciplic succession is not ended with Srila Prabhupada.
I will go on with or without you.
It is going on right now.

GURU TATTVA #3 DRONACHARYA DIKSA GURU..KRISHNA SIKSA GURU

Discussion on guru tattva #3
Considering Arjuna and Dronacharya.
Dronacharya was Arjuna's spiritual master.
He was also the spiritual master for all the Pandavas and the Kurus.
The young men learned among other things discipline....
control of the mind and senses.... and military arts from their guru.
Which is appropriate since they were kshatriya's not brahmanas.
If they had been brahmanas they would have learned discipline...
control of the mind and senses... and how to study the Vedas,
perform rituals and sacrifices, chant mantras and worship the deities.
So Dronacharya was Arjuna's initiating spiritual master.
They studied in his school under his direct supervision.
It wasn't until later on when Arjuna was faced with a dilemma
of how to perform his duty as a kshatriya that Krishna Himself
not in some vague or all pervading way,
but Krishna in human form who actually was on the planet at the time
became his instructing guru. Krishna was Arjuna's siksa guru.
"...Now I am Your disciple, and a soul surrendered unto You.
Please instruct me." BG 2.7
In what?
"The Blessed Lord said: I instructed this imperishable science of yoga to the sun-god, Vivasvān, and Vivasvān instructed it to Manu, the father of mankind, and Manu in turn instructed it to Ikṣvāku." BG 4.1
And how is it received?
"This supreme science was thus received through the chain of disciplic succession, and the saintly kings understood it in that way. But in course of time the succession was broken, and therefore the science as it is appears to be lost." BG 4.2
"That very ancient science of the relationship with the Supreme is today told by Me to you because you are My devotee as well as My friend..." BG 4.3
In BG 4.2. Krishna says the science "appears" to lost. In the BG 4.1 Krishna says the science is imperishable.
If the science is imperishable then the succession is also imperishable and only appears to be lost from time to time. In other words the disciplic succession never ends. There is no "final acarya to end all acaryas."
For there to be a disciple there must discipline
for there to be discipline there must be a person spiritual master.
It is not enough to have some all pervading idea of a spiritual master.
That is not the imperishable science of yoga
Krishna is personally presenting to Arjuna.
If I am correct in my understanding...
This shows how very, very significant the siksa guru is.
How the diksa guru and the siksa guru can
perform "different specific functions."

GURU TATTVA #2 DISCIPLIC SUCCESS DOES NOT END ..THERE IS A SYSTEM

Discussion on guru tattva #2
Devotee comment:
For me is Prabhupada the spiritual master and last archarya!
and yes read the books and Prabhupada live in heard!!
Meena Devi Dasi:
This is apasampardaya. Yes. Srila Prabhupada can be heard in His books. Anyone can hear Him there. Like in a big pandal of 10,000 people.
He is speaking on the podium. Everyone can hear.
But not everyone is His disciple.
After He disappears... the recordings are there, the books are there.
But He has disappeared.
The system since time immemorial is
that the disciple becomes the spiritual master.
It is by qualification. Not by appointment.
Which was the mistake the devotees made in 1977.
But that was 40 years ago and that is not the situation now.
It is by qualification. If you study the books like "Srimad Bhagavatam"
you will see... Brahma to Narada, Narada to Vyasadeva,
Vyasadeva to Sukadeva, Sukadeva to Suta Goswami
who was present at the passing away of Pariksit Maharaja.
Srila Prabhupada is in that line of succession and it is still going on.
It did not end with Srila Prabhupada. It will never end.
If someone wants to actually be connected
they have to go through the system,
otherwise they can just stay in audience in the pandal.
That is alright, but they will not reach to perfection that way.